Re: [tlug] (OT) The enigma of Japan

[JC Helary <brandelune@example.com>]

On mercredi 10 juin 09, at 16:23, Josh Glover wrote:

> 2009/6/9 JC Helary <brandelune@example.com>:
>
> > As far as human societies are concerned, I don't think there is
> > anything like "orthodoxy" or "effectiveness". It is all messy and not
> > by the rules.
>
> Yes, but surely you can see examples of cultures that value "the
> rules" more than others. Consider the public transport systems of
> Japan and Germany. Compare them to the English and American ones (I
> mean, in American cities that actually *have* public transport). Let's
> not even consider the horror that is the Irish public "transport"
> "system". ;)

The only public transportation systems I can compare are the French  
one and the Japanese one.

What I can say is that French trains, stations, facilities in general  
are seemingly more often degraded that their Japanese counterpart.

One explanation I have, empirical as it may be, is that the Japanese  
system respects the user. Conductors don't bug you when you do not  
have your ticket, you can either buy it from them of at the exit. You  
can put your feet on the seats here, at the condition that you remove  
your shoes. "System people" are polite and try to solve your problems  
(in general).

In France, it is pretty much the opposite of what I described for  
Japan. Everything, from the entrance to the exit is made to make you  
feel under pressure. There is no respect whatsoever for users, no  
systematic politeness (you can find polite service individuals  
though). And there is systemic suspicion that the user is trying to  
abuse the system. Which may or may not be true, but the social costs  
of such a suspicious system are huge and actually contribute to  
generating the abuse.

In Japan, rules are easy (easier ?) to follow, and they don't involve  
giving up any right to a decent treatment. There may be a punishment  
if the rule is not followed but the punishment is generally not  
explicitly put right under your nose.

Needless to say I prefer this transportation system, even if I  
consider it to be uselessly noisy.

Behind all this is a culture of obedience that of course we do not  
have in France. A culture where kids are made to internalize a strict  
senpai/kohai social structure from their early age, structure that  
will later be a frame for much of their social conduct. It is an  
inherently violent structure/society that shapes humans as obedient  
creatures (sweeping generalization warning). They don't need to be  
told they'll be punished if they don't obey because they know they  
will. It is not (only) their sempai at school that will scold them for  
a-social behavior, but the dokyusei will not approve and the teachers  
neither.

The system works well because the acknowledged hierarchy (client above  
service people) makes it work that way, and you can see sometimes  
service people take shit from (mostly drunk but not only) customers a  
way that is impossible in France -you'd have a dozen subway police  
thugs come instantly and take the guy away... Internalized violence  
can easily be unleashed when you set the system to work the other way  
round, when you define a lower state being that can take shit without  
saying anything...




Jean-Christophe Helary