Re: tlug: Re: Linux taking over the globe?

[Karl-Max Wagner <karlmax@example.com>]

> Word and Excel have macro languages.  Some pretty well-paid
> "programmers" know nothing else.

The quotation marks are well deserved.....

> If you know Emacs LISP, you can program for almost any platform.
> Ditto Perl, although I hate to admit it ;-)
> 
> In the end, "learning Linux" has nothing to do with this.  You don't
> have to learn Linux to use it anymore; TurboLinux has proved that.
> 
> The benefits of learning Linux are not a prerequisite for living and
> working in a technical society.

But they are benefits nevertheless.

> Bullshit.  Anything that can be built with GCC on Linux can be built
> with DJGPP on DOS, except for stuff that #include's <linux/...>
> stuff.  And by using RSXNT, you can build lots of stuff on Windows
> that can't be built on Linux (well, lots of RSXNT developers _build_
> on Linux, but of course you mostly can't use it on Linux given the
> state of WinE).

In principle yes, says Radio Eriwan, but.....that's a pain in
the ass !

Under Linux you just go ahead and get it done !

> Free software is free, and the first big decision most Linux users
> have to make is whether to wipe that other "free" OS off their box,

Not every. A large portion of boxes these days have been
assembled by the future user himself or by one of his/her
computer savvy buddies - and thus they come blank.

> The benefits of using a real OS are not in the user interface; they're 
> in efficient implementation of pipes as buffers rather than temp
> files, real multiuser, multitasking processes, a network-oriented GUI, 
> etc, etc.

Coorect. And they are a big plus in even the simplest
programming tasks.

> What's Un*xoid?  NT is more or less POSIX-compliant, I believe.  Nor

Forget the "more". It is Pain In The Ass (tm) compliant for
sure.                            

> is it going to go away soon.

Weeds don't perish, as the saying goes.....

> Really what it comes down to, as far as I can tell, is that you think
> everybody should know a modicum of shell programming.  And that is not 

That too.....

> possible to learn on NT (well, I haven't tried 4NT, the shareware
> command processor for NT and Win32; if it does for NT what 4DOS does
> for DOS, it's ugly and deserving of a famous "Warning: 4NT Programming 
> Considered Harmful" article, but far far better than nothing), because 
> the important uses of shell scripts are administrative wrappers and
> cooperative glue between apps, and NT insists on a very clumsy GUI for 
> the former and OLE for the latter.

Another case for Radio Eriwan.....

================================================================
"It was hell. They knew it.          Karl-Max Wagner
  But they called it                 karlmax@example.com
    W-I-N-D-O-Z-E"
================================================================
---------------------------------------------------------------
Next Meeting: 10 October, 12:30 Tokyo Station Yaesu central gate
Featuring the IMASY Eng. Team on "IPv6 - The Next Generation IP"
Next Nomikai: 20 November, 19:30  Tengu TokyoEkiMae 03-3275-3691
---------------------------------------------------------------
Sponsor: PHT, makers of TurboLinux http://www.pht.co.jp